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Post by beaverhuntr on Sept 13, 2019 10:43:03 GMT -7
Yeah. In no way am I concerned about it. Kyler just made some rookie mistakes, which is obviously expected in your first NFL game. He’ll get better. Just look at the growth of Lamar Jackson in one year. Some guys never grow. (we've had plenty of Brandon Williams types where the fans are saying "give him time") But KM will grow. He's going to be a superstar in this league. His accuracy and release is none amazing! The ball comes out of his hand so quick.
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Post by aris on Sept 13, 2019 10:49:22 GMT -7
Just look at the growth of Lamar Jackson in one year. Some guys never grow. (we've had plenty of Brandon Williams types where the fans are saying "give him time") But KM will grow. He's going to be a superstar in this league. His accuracy and release is boinking amazing! The ball comes out of his hand so quick. It was the 4th quarter. The Lions knew we had to pass the ball. The backs all had their backs turned and KM exploded for a long run. Looked like he was shot out of a cannon. That is what RW does to teams game after game year after year.
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Post by cardinalsdo on Sept 13, 2019 13:22:23 GMT -7
Aris Honest fact. I was going to say opinion but the truth hurts sometimes. Kyler Murray is suppose to be able to elude the rush. 5 sacks is scary as Detroit is not known for it pass rush. In the video below Patrick Onwausor ILB for the RAVENS speaks to the media plus he talks about Terrell Suggs and what he learned from him. Baltimore has a tough defense as long as I can remember. I know their starting corners are hurting and that is about it. 1. Away game 2. Home opener for the Ravens 3. Great Defense 4. Lamar Jackson is playing a hot hand 5. Lot of Trouble for Our Cardinals www.baltimoreravens.com/video/patrick-onwausor-home-opener-will-be-huge-for-defenseIf you don't have an offensive line, even bad defenses can create pressure. 5 sacks is way too many to rationalize that our QB should have the speed to evade the rush. If your QB is getting sacked 5 times in a game, your OL is not doing their job. Granted at least 1 of those sacks was Murray's fault because he held onto the ball too long instead of throwing it away. But the OL didn't create the holes in the running game either. We had 3rd and 1 and couldn't convert. The line was so bad, they couldn't run boot legs because the OL was like a sieve.
The truth is the reason Kingsburry couldn't run half the stuff he wanted to is because the OL isn't good enough. He was kind enough not to blame his players and blamed himself for being too cute with the playcalling. The reason the old Jim Kelly (K-Gun) no huddle run n shoot was implemented is because the OL isn't good enough to hold their blocks. That style of offense allows for quick passes and the up-tempo style doesn't allow defenses to get set.
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Post by clutchdj on Sept 13, 2019 14:02:52 GMT -7
I love Kyler but I’d argue 3 at least of those sacks were on him trying to do too much.
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Post by flash on Sept 13, 2019 19:36:47 GMT -7
Aris Honest fact. I was going to say opinion but the truth hurts sometimes. Kyler Murray is suppose to be able to elude the rush. 5 sacks is scary as Detroit is not known for it pass rush. In the video below Patrick Onwausor ILB for the RAVENS speaks to the media plus he talks about Terrell Suggs and what he learned from him. Baltimore has a tough defense as long as I can remember. I know their starting corners are hurting and that is about it. 1. Away game 2. Home opener for the Ravens 3. Great Defense 4. Lamar Jackson is playing a hot hand 5. Lot of Trouble for Our Cardinals www.baltimoreravens.com/video/patrick-onwausor-home-opener-will-be-huge-for-defenseIf you don't have an offensive line, even bad defenses can create pressure. 5 sacks is way too many to rationalize that our QB should have the speed to evade the rush. If your QB is getting sacked 5 times in a game, your OL is not doing their job. Granted at least 1 of those sacks was Murray's fault because he held onto the ball too long instead of throwing it away. But the OL didn't create the holes in the running game either. We had 3rd and 1 and couldn't convert. The line was so bad, they couldn't run boot legs because the OL was like a sieve.
The truth is the reason Kingsburry couldn't run half the stuff he wanted to is because the OL isn't good enough. He was kind enough not to blame his players and blamed himself for being too cute with the playcalling. The reason the old Jim Kelly (K-Gun) no huddle run n shoot was implemented is because the OL isn't good enough to hold their blocks. That style of offense allows for quick passes and the up-tempo style doesn't allow defenses to get set.
The Lions were ranked 8th in Pass Defense last season. Do you think some of those 5 sacks could have been coverage sacks? I only caught the tail end of the game, so I don't know whether the Oline held up or not on those sacks.
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Post by Rimrock on Sept 13, 2019 19:42:24 GMT -7
If you don't have an offensive line, even bad defenses can create pressure. 5 sacks is way too many to rationalize that our QB should have the speed to evade the rush. If your QB is getting sacked 5 times in a game, your OL is not doing their job. Granted at least 1 of those sacks was Murray's fault because he held onto the ball too long instead of throwing it away. But the OL didn't create the holes in the running game either. We had 3rd and 1 and couldn't convert. The line was so bad, they couldn't run boot legs because the OL was like a sieve.
The truth is the reason Kingsburry couldn't run half the stuff he wanted to is because the OL isn't good enough. He was kind enough not to blame his players and blamed himself for being too cute with the playcalling. The reason the old Jim Kelly (K-Gun) no huddle run n shoot was implemented is because the OL isn't good enough to hold their blocks. That style of offense allows for quick passes and the up-tempo style doesn't allow defenses to get set.
The Lions were ranked 8th in Pass Defense last season. Do you think some of those 5 sacks could have been coverage sacks? I only caught the tail end of the game, so I don't know whether the Oline held up or not on those sacks. Depends on what you consider "held Up"....Kyler held on to the ball way to long on some of them.....Oline wasn't great and they were`nt horrible either
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Post by flash on Sept 13, 2019 19:48:25 GMT -7
The Lions were ranked 8th in Pass Defense last season. Do you think some of those 5 sacks could have been coverage sacks? I only caught the tail end of the game, so I don't know whether the Oline held up or not on those sacks. Depends on what you consider "held Up"....Kyler held on to the ball way to long on some of them.....Oline wasn't great and they were`nt horrible either "Held up" as in did Murray actually have time to throw the ball? Or was it like last season when Rosen got pummeled? If he had time to throw the ball, then more than likely it was his fault for not seeing the WR's if they were open and held on to the ball too long.
Seems Murray did not do that in the 4th quarter.
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Post by ConnecticutCard on Sept 14, 2019 14:56:49 GMT -7
There was a couple plays where he even scrambled out of the pocket and it was downright bizarre that he took a sack instead of throwing it away, for a major loss of yards too. I’m being optimistic and chalking it up to first game jitters, but I’m definitely going to be keeping an eye on those plays going forward. Same with the pick early in the game, there was nothing there, he was out of the pocket, throw it away
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Post by Rimrock on Sept 14, 2019 16:15:20 GMT -7
There was a couple plays where he even scrambled out of the pocket and it was downright bizarre that he took a sack instead of throwing it away, for a major loss of yards too. I’m being optimistic and chalking it up to first game jitters, but I’m definitely going to be keeping an eye on those plays going forward. Same with the pick early in the game, there was nothing there, he was out of the pocket, throw it away Yeah that one play was crazy that he ate all those yards...i just wrote it off as a rookie move...but it was x2 dumb rookie move
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Post by jeffcardinalfan on Sept 15, 2019 5:15:29 GMT -7
im extremely impatient but we gotta give km a little time. whether it was cause detroit relaxed some or not it was great the way the whole team kept fighting. remember all those years where cards couldnt even put up a fight. as far as last year, that was a dupmster fire/trainwreck/snafu/fubar and we were expecting a bohica which is what we got for 3 quarters offensively last week. imho we see progress from km this week win or lose.
i also think its underrated how much of what larry does motivates the whole team. if i were kk/km it would be tops on my list to get larry going early-every game. he is the only player on the team that seemingly ALWAYS delivers when its needed most. imagine being the opponents dc thinking the cards stink-we'll put 2 guys on larry and we'll be ok and in crunch time larry still makes the crucial plays and he's done it over and over again. i never thought carson really recognized this in larry-warner did...maybe after last week kk/km will recognize it to.
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Post by BigRedFan on Sept 15, 2019 13:51:23 GMT -7
Yeah. In no way am I concerned about it. Kyler just made some rookie mistakes, which is obviously expected in your first NFL game. He’ll get better. Just look at the growth of Lamar Jackson in one year. Some guys never grow. (we've had plenty of Brandon Williams types where the fans are saying "give him time") But KM will grow. He's going to be a superstar in this league. This is the best post regarding KM I've seen. 100% agreement. It won't be Kyler that fails the organization, it might be the other way around. Please Mr. Bidwell Find someone who can evaluate talent. Build a competent team around this future star. Go Cardinals.
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Post by FLCardinalFan on Sept 15, 2019 14:03:08 GMT -7
TWO STRAIGHT GAMES OVER 300 YARDS bad Off Line rookie coach making mistakes 1 INT VS 2 TDS Kyler Murray is good really good and can become great.
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Post by CardSunsCard on Sept 15, 2019 21:46:18 GMT -7
TWO STRAIGHT GAMES OVER 300 YARDS bad Off Line rookie coach making mistakes 1 INT VS 2 TDS Kyler Murray is good really good and can become great.
300 yards became a meaningless stat years ago once the NFL brass neutered what defenses could do. Murray could end up being great, but the only three things I care about are 1. TD/INT ratio 2. Completion % 3. Whether the guy shows positive leadership traits. I already know Kyler has #3. I want to see what 1 and 2 look like by the end of the season. He's in a spread offense so he should be putting up higher completion percentage numbers than a QB in a more traditional offense. If he can carry a 2 to 1 TD/INT ration by season end, I'll consider his season a success. In a KK Air Raid offense, anything less than 300 passing yards per game would be a failure in my eyes. Unless we are gashing the team on the ground and we throw less than 20 attempts. I don't see that happening this year given we can't run the ball to save our lives. Kyler is also in an offense tailor made for his strengths. He should be lighting up the scoreboard in KK's system. I'm not putting the blame on him because he's shown solid improvement in just two games. That being said, the top 3 QB's coming out next year could be doing the same thing, because it's not like there's a huge learning curve between KK's system and what these kids run in college. The learning curve is on the O-line, which is why most rookie Offensive lineman entering the league aren't prepared anymore. Speaking off, as much as I like Wirfs out of Iowa, and the Wisconsin kid, people need to realize neither of those teams runs a spread attack. I'm not even sure Trent Williams would be a great fit here. The best spread lineman are 'Dancing Bears' like Tunsil. I could be wrong, but I'm also thinking Joe Thomas played spread in college. I'm all for drafting multiple lineman next year, but i don't think we need to spend our first two picks on one. I think we are better served using one high pick on a lineman, and using cap space we recover from trading PP, to grab a solid veteran that still has a little 'spring' left in his step. (Not an Keim injury special either ) The third O-lineman, I'd like to grab in lower rounds. Spread lineman aren't valued as high as others. There is always a a decent spread lineman who drops to the late 4th or 5th round.
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Post by FLCardinalFan on Sept 15, 2019 22:28:24 GMT -7
TWO STRAIGHT GAMES OVER 300 YARDS bad Off Line rookie coach making mistakes 1 INT VS 2 TDS Kyler Murray is good really good and can become great.
300 yards became a meaningless stat years ago once the NFL brass neutered what defenses could do. Murray could end up being great, but the only three things I care about are 1. TD/INT ratio 2. Completion % 3. Whether the guy shows positive leadership traits. I already know Kyler has #3. I want to see what 1 and 2 look like by the end of the season. He's in a spread offense so he should be putting up higher completion percentage numbers than a QB in a more traditional offense. If he can carry a 2 to 1 TD/INT ration by season end, I'll consider his season a success. In a KK Air Raid offense, anything less than 300 passing yards per game would be a failure in my eyes. Unless we are gashing the team on the ground and we throw less than 20 attempts. I don't see that happening this year given we can't run the ball to save our lives. Kyler is also in an offense tailor made for his strengths. He should be lighting up the scoreboard in KK's system. I'm not putting the blame on him because he's shown solid improvement in just two games. That being said, the top 3 QB's coming out next year could be doing the same thing, because it's not like there's a huge learning curve between KK's system and what these kids run in college. The learning curve is on the O-line, which is why most rookie Offensive lineman entering the league aren't prepared anymore. Speaking off, as much as I like Wirfs out of Iowa, and the Wisconsin kid, people need to realize neither of those teams runs a spread attack. I'm not even sure Trent Williams would be a great fit here. The best spread lineman are 'Dancing Bears' like Tunsil. I could be wrong, but I'm also thinking Joe Thomas played spread in college. I'm all for drafting multiple lineman next year, but i don't think we need to spend our first two picks on one. I think we are better served using one high pick on a lineman, and using cap space we recover from trading PP, to grab a solid veteran that still has a little 'spring' left in his step. (Not an Keim injury special either ) The third O-lineman, I'd like to grab in lower rounds. Spread lineman aren't valued as high as others. There is always a a decent spread lineman who drops to the late 4th or 5th round. Good job ryashlee. Well thought out post. TD/Int is very important, Comp % is too Lamar Jackson was not that high right? But he sure has improved. And Murray is putting the team on his back as a leader. The most important coach on this team is Sean Kugler. He has to develop these linemen. Next year we may need a RB in the 2nd or 3rd rd if DJ plays at this pace he is right now.
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Post by njcardfan on Sept 15, 2019 23:56:06 GMT -7
Has this team ever had a good oline? Or just a good qb? The oline was good when Warner was under center and when Palmer was under center. Between those years, horrible.
The offensive line in the mid 70's was one of the greatest offensive lines in football history. When you have a QB with cement shoes like Jim Hart and he only gets sacked 8 times all season, that's greatness. Lomax's O-Lines were good as was the '98 team. So, yeah, this team did have good to great offensive lines. As for now, both Arians and Whisenhunt treated the offensive line as second class citizens using spit and paste in most instances(Keim spent a lot of money on players who were as fragile as paper mache). Oh, and Sweezy is down right abysmal and a drive killer.
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