|
|
JG
Dec 9, 2024 10:11:50 GMT -7
via mobile
Post by flash on Dec 9, 2024 10:11:50 GMT -7
Another ugly loss today merits further comment on this topic, IMO.
1) Are JG and his staff of coaches adequate, improving, or regressing? 1a) Whichever, who seems most deserving of praise or blame? 1b) Do you think JG a good head coach, or is he too "hands-off"?
2) Are the players adequate, improving or regressing since the season began? 2a) If so or if not, who/where/what are the involved parts of the team, or individual players?
3) Is it too early to speak of a failing rebuild, or near the time to draw a line in the sand? 3a) Would giving responsible people ultimatums now be deserved, or should it wait? 3b) Would team or staff morale be seriously damaged by issuing ultimatums to some? 3c) Is concern about morale more important than a true turnaround and more wins?
4) Has Monti O. done all he can and should to make general improvement possible?
5) Is this post deserved, or is it frustration from witnessing yet another weak display
by offense, defense and coaching - not necessarily in that order? 
The whole team is regressing. Murray Coaching Offensive Line WR's Dline Seems the CB's are doing the best and even that is mediocre or below. |
|
|
|
JG
Dec 9, 2024 12:26:22 GMT -7
CardCore likes this
Post by knobby on Dec 9, 2024 12:26:22 GMT -7
Kyler would be mortified and want out. Let him explore that. Too true. We apparently will allow his feelings and contract money to veto what is arguably the better way to go. Ah, the price of player agents' ploys and failing to follow good business practice... will we (MB) never learn? |
|
|
|
JG
Dec 9, 2024 12:59:54 GMT -7
Post by End Zone on Dec 9, 2024 12:59:54 GMT -7
Kyler would be mortified and want out. Let him explore that. Too true. We apparently will allow his feelings and contract money to veto what is arguably the better way to go. Ah, the price of player agents' ploys and failing to follow good business practice... will we (MB) never learn? The team agent that committed to the contract was Mr. Steve Keim. We have learned plenty about him since that contract was signed. I think we (and MB) have learned a thing or two about QB talent since 2019. |
|
|
|
JG
Dec 9, 2024 13:21:20 GMT -7
Post by FLCardinalFan on Dec 9, 2024 13:21:20 GMT -7
the college HC jobs enticing to good coaches…they can sign the player or players of their choice without CAP restrictions as the NFL has as well as having 100 man roster… the college HC jobs enticing to good coaches…they can sign the player or players of their choice without CAP restrictions as the NFL has as well as having 100 man roster… the college HC jobs enticing to good coaches…they can sign the player or players of their choice without CAP restrictions as the NFL has as well as having 100 man roster… makes the college HC jobs enticing to good coaches…they can sign the player or players of their choice without CAP restrictions as the NFL has as well as having 100 man roster… This is why the legendary College coach Bud Wilkinson failed when he went to the NFL to coach the St. Louis Cardinals after he retired from the college game. He said he used to be able to go deep on his roster and pick up a 3rd 4th string player to start. Most of them were still stars from their high school days even though they were backups in college. Oklahoma was so deep back then They won under Wilkinson 3 National titles 14 conference championships His college record was 145-29-4 Oklahoma still holds the record of 47 straight wins under Wilkinson. unfortunately he was 9-20 in his Cardinal years |
|
|
|
JG
Dec 9, 2024 13:37:58 GMT -7
Post by knobby on Dec 9, 2024 13:37:58 GMT -7
Since the Cardinals are unable to change the team leader due to contractual commitments, then the coaches must find a way to help the QB be successful. And if the coaches cannot do that, change the coaches.The sad thing is that the coaching staff has done well in creating better team spirit, and have at times shown ability to generate new schemes. BUT they have not done very well with planning for, reacting, executing and overcoming opposing teams' tactics, especially recently. Is that from lack of experience, lack of ability, or lack of preparation and research? Does Monti interact and observe closely enough to determine where the weak links are? We must hope that if changes are made, they are made in the right places. It is impossible for fans to know as outsiders, so we are left with after the fact guessing based on what we see for ourselves. With that understood, this fan thinks there is at least one weak aspect in the coaching group, maybe more. Otherwise, how can there be such wide variations between games in how the team performs? One would expect that the abilities and actions of players are largely stable week to week, even in a losing game, yet that has not been obvious to we viewers lately. Team performance has been up and down recently, and anything but consistent. "Completely unprepared" is a term which seems to fit... What happened? What changed? There were signs of progress which seemed to disappear, especially after the bye - IMHO. Are coaches not getting enough sleep, or have one or more reached the limits of their capability? IMHO |
|
|
|
JG
Dec 9, 2024 13:49:46 GMT -7
Post by knobby on Dec 9, 2024 13:49:46 GMT -7
I think we (and MB) have learned a thing or two about QB talent since 2019 I could agree with that if we had a proven capable #2 QB..... or do we have a hidden in plain sight standby? |
|
|
|
Post by Dry Heat on Dec 9, 2024 15:11:06 GMT -7
I think we (and MB) have learned a thing or two about QB talent since 2019 I could agree with that if we had a proven capable #2 QB..... or do we have a hidden in plain sight standby? If and when we are truly out of playoff hopes, I would be ok with giving Tune a game or two, with the understanding it was to evaluate his progress as a QB#2. Real games are the only way to really know. |
|
|
|
Post by MT Diesel on Dec 11, 2024 7:21:09 GMT -7
I have been critical of players and coaches after disappointing performances. The NFL is unique and different from college…college FB is the biggest and most loyal fan base of any sport in the world. The NFL has it’s moments and the playoffs and SB are king in the televised world where all the deep pockets advertise.
I have to also be critical of fans who compare what is going on with the Cards who continually compare what other teams are doing as well as have done…it is difficult to cross compare…there are too many non-similar factors. That being said I would like to point out the Lions and how long it has taken for them as a coaching staff and GM to get consistent play and were boosted in draft capital with trading Stafford. Also the Goff play…he was very inconsistent and has developed into a more dependable QB after McVay washed his hands of him…the Lions have a brighter future with Goff being a more consistent QB and his age and loyalty to the Lions and Stafford is at the end of his career.
Long story short…as frustrating as the downward spiral has been post bye…it is to be expected from a young roster and even a 6 year vet QB who is working out the kinks of a OC he has been playing with for a year and new offensive weapons. We as fans want instant success and it isn’t realistic.
The longer Petzing and K1 work together the better the consistency will be. It didn’t happen in the 2nd year as it could have….a 7-9 win season is right in line where many have projected…myself I could see a 11 win team pre-season…that isn’t happening and instead of jumping off a cliff or wanting a teardown…I hope the Cards stick with their process and look for better play in 2025….is it disappointing? Yes
This doesn’t fit the narrative of the one’s who have really disliked or hated K1 and he has opened the door for all kinds of criticism.
The second C-Chicken loss hit me harder than many…I had a couple days of not wanting to even engage in talking about the Cards…viewing the Lopez presser early in the week was good and helped me appreciate how much the players care and it is basic…earning respect. This team has many players who are respectable and given time they will shine…maybe not on our terms as fans.
I have come to grips with the reality the Cards are not as good as I personally expected and have also have great expectation this staff and GM are the best thing in the desert in years and will keep on course in getting the Cards to be a respectable team.
K1 will be the QB in 2025. The NFC West is still a solid division and it will take a respectable team to be successful in the West. Go Cards.
|
|
|
|
JG
Dec 11, 2024 7:38:12 GMT -7
via mobile
Post by flash on Dec 11, 2024 7:38:12 GMT -7
I have been critical of players and coaches after disappointing performances. The NFL is unique and different from college…college FB is the biggest and most loyal fan base of any sport in the world. The NFL has it’s moments and the playoffs and SB are king in the televised world where all the deep pockets advertise. I have to also be critical of fans who compare what is going on with the Cards who continually compare what other teams are doing as well as have done…it is difficult to cross compare…there are too many non-similar factors. That being said I would like to point out the Lions and how long it has taken for them as a coaching staff and GM to get consistent play and were boosted in draft capital with trading Stafford. Also the Goff play…he was very inconsistent and has developed into a more dependable QB after McVay washed his hands of him…the Lions have a brighter future with Goff being a more consistent QB and his age and loyalty to the Lions and Stafford is at the end of his career. Long story short…as frustrating as the downward spiral has been post bye…it is to be expected from a young roster and even a 6 year vet QB who is working out the kinks of a OC he has been playing with for a year and new offensive weapons. We as fans want instant success and it isn’t realistic. The longer Petzing and K1 work together the better the consistency will be. It didn’t happen in the 2nd year as it could have….a 7-9 win season is right in line where many have projected…myself I could see a 11 win team pre-season…that isn’t happening and instead of jumping off a cliff or wanting a teardown…I hope the Cards stick with their process and look for better play in 2025….is it disappointing? Yes This doesn’t fit the narrative of the one’s who have really disliked or hated K1 and he has opened the door for all kinds of criticism. The second C-Chicken loss hit me harder than many…I had a couple days of not wanting to even engage in talking about the Cards…viewing the Lopez presser early in the week was good and helped me appreciate how much the players care and it is basic…earning respect. This team has many players who are respectable and given time they will shine…maybe not on our terms as fans. I have come to grips with the reality the Cards are not as good as I personally expected and have also have great expectation this staff and GM are the best thing in the desert in years and will keep on course in getting the Cards to be a respectable team. K1 will be the QB in 2025. The NFC West is still a solid division and it will take a respectable team to be successful in the West. Go Cards. Great post Diesel! You're 100% correct when you say the Coaches have to step up and work with what they have. If we win at least 2 or more games, we are where we should be in the second year of our rebuild. Less than 2 wins and we're behind in our rebuild. |
|
|
|
JG
Dec 11, 2024 7:56:17 GMT -7
Post by MT Diesel on Dec 11, 2024 7:56:17 GMT -7
I have been critical of players and coaches after disappointing performances. The NFL is unique and different from college…college FB is the biggest and most loyal fan base of any sport in the world. The NFL has it’s moments and the playoffs and SB are king in the televised world where all the deep pockets advertise. I have to also be critical of fans who compare what is going on with the Cards who continually compare what other teams are doing as well as have done…it is difficult to cross compare…there are too many non-similar factors. That being said I would like to point out the Lions and how long it has taken for them as a coaching staff and GM to get consistent play and were boosted in draft capital with trading Stafford. Also the Goff play…he was very inconsistent and has developed into a more dependable QB after McVay washed his hands of him…the Lions have a brighter future with Goff being a more consistent QB and his age and loyalty to the Lions and Stafford is at the end of his career. Long story short…as frustrating as the downward spiral has been post bye…it is to be expected from a young roster and even a 6 year vet QB who is working out the kinks of a OC he has been playing with for a year and new offensive weapons. We as fans want instant success and it isn’t realistic. The longer Petzing and K1 work together the better the consistency will be. It didn’t happen in the 2nd year as it could have….a 7-9 win season is right in line where many have projected…myself I could see a 11 win team pre-season…that isn’t happening and instead of jumping off a cliff or wanting a teardown…I hope the Cards stick with their process and look for better play in 2025….is it disappointing? Yes This doesn’t fit the narrative of the one’s who have really disliked or hated K1 and he has opened the door for all kinds of criticism. The second C-Chicken loss hit me harder than many…I had a couple days of not wanting to even engage in talking about the Cards…viewing the Lopez presser early in the week was good and helped me appreciate how much the players care and it is basic…earning respect. This team has many players who are respectable and given time they will shine…maybe not on our terms as fans. I have come to grips with the reality the Cards are not as good as I personally expected and have also have great expectation this staff and GM are the best thing in the desert in years and will keep on course in getting the Cards to be a respectable team. K1 will be the QB in 2025. The NFC West is still a solid division and it will take a respectable team to be successful in the West. Go Cards. Great post Diesel! You're 100% correct when you say the Coaches have to step up and work with what they have. If we win at least 2 or more games, we are where we should be in the second year of our rebuild. Less than 2 wins and we're behind in our rebuild. Best laid plans get blown up at times. The old Navy was steady the course…despite the wind and current and whatever the assault from the enemies…allowing the environment and challenges to knock the ship off course lead to death and failure…success can only be achieved by steady the course. |
|
|
|
JG
Dec 11, 2024 8:46:29 GMT -7
flash likes this
Post by Dry Heat on Dec 11, 2024 8:46:29 GMT -7
I have been critical of players and coaches after disappointing performances. The NFL is unique and different from college…college FB is the biggest and most loyal fan base of any sport in the world. The NFL has it’s moments and the playoffs and SB are king in the televised world where all the deep pockets advertise. I have to also be critical of fans who compare what is going on with the Cards who continually compare what other teams are doing as well as have done…it is difficult to cross compare…there are too many non-similar factors. That being said I would like to point out the Lions and how long it has taken for them as a coaching staff and GM to get consistent play and were boosted in draft capital with trading Stafford. Also the Goff play…he was very inconsistent and has developed into a more dependable QB after McVay washed his hands of him…the Lions have a brighter future with Goff being a more consistent QB and his age and loyalty to the Lions and Stafford is at the end of his career. Long story short…as frustrating as the downward spiral has been post bye…it is to be expected from a young roster and even a 6 year vet QB who is working out the kinks of a OC he has been playing with for a year and new offensive weapons. We as fans want instant success and it isn’t realistic. The longer Petzing and K1 work together the better the consistency will be. It didn’t happen in the 2nd year as it could have….a 7-9 win season is right in line where many have projected…myself I could see a 11 win team pre-season…that isn’t happening and instead of jumping off a cliff or wanting a teardown…I hope the Cards stick with their process and look for better play in 2025….is it disappointing? Yes This doesn’t fit the narrative of the one’s who have really disliked or hated K1 and he has opened the door for all kinds of criticism. The second C-Chicken loss hit me harder than many…I had a couple days of not wanting to even engage in talking about the Cards…viewing the Lopez presser early in the week was good and helped me appreciate how much the players care and it is basic…earning respect. This team has many players who are respectable and given time they will shine…maybe not on our terms as fans. I have come to grips with the reality the Cards are not as good as I personally expected and have also have great expectation this staff and GM are the best thing in the desert in years and will keep on course in getting the Cards to be a respectable team. K1 will be the QB in 2025. The NFC West is still a solid division and it will take a respectable team to be successful in the West. Go Cards. Excellent. Perhaps the loss didn’t hit me as hard because the 2024 Cardinals are about right where I thought they would be in Dec 2024, and I expected 8 or 9 wins and felt that would mark a success in the rebuild. I’ve coached in another sport and started a few businesses, and I think those experiences give a person a certain realism about what is possible when building a program. 2023 wasn’t even a full year 1 of a rebuild. It was a clearing of the decks contract and roster-wise with a QB1 on injured reserve and a team culture in the dumps after the mess of a GM with major personal issues allowed to be in his job too long. Year 1 was a success in clearing those decks and installing a new culture alongside what looks to be one of the better drafts in decades. Year 2 was a success in likely doubling our 2024 win total and being in the playoff race in a solid division and getting a host of rookie and second year players a ton of playing time and experience. Year 3’s success will be judged by yet another improved record extending from additional experience and learning by our current roster and coaches and supplanted by a potentially massive free agency made possible by the contract clearing and cap management in years 1 and 2 as well as another draft of talent infusion meeting the “cost of admission”. Year 3-5 was always the playoff window for me, with an additional optimistic hope of establishing the culture and team management that leads to even longer sustained success. We will see. |
|
