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Post by MT Diesel on Oct 11, 2024 14:05:20 GMT -7
A little nugget from PFF is the Cardinals OL has the 11th best pass blocking rating as an entire unit in the NFL.
Even with the injuries this is proof of the quality of the OL.
Paris commented on the continuity between the OL players since training camp has helped him. This is evidence of the high value of signing Evan Brown who has held down LG. The two right side players out do present a challenge and as Paris said they will hold the ones filling in to a standard already set.
Beach has been a great support as well. Colon and him having significant snaps in 2023 and what he was able to contribute in 2024 is another overlooked player of significance. Beyond the nitpicking of Colon and his play…it was of no news when he stepped in last week. That is a win when 2nd and 3rd string OL players are called upon.
As the season progresses it will be ugly at times and the staff has built some depth that will help keep the team afloat.
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Post by thomas cat on Oct 11, 2024 18:24:23 GMT -7
I don't have access to PFF, so thanks for letting us know. Even though I thought we might have improved, that's better than what I would have thought. I further investigated this.... here is what I found.... As per this link...we are #5 in total yards rushing and #3 in yards per carry rushing. As per this link we have allowed 2.2 sacks per game for a rank of 11th best. All told, not too bad and reenforces what the PFF says. And as you point out, we are doing it with some backups. I have always been a believer that the offensive line matters. Maybe we are finally putting a good one together including back-ups. |
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Post by Dry Heat on Oct 11, 2024 21:42:20 GMT -7
I don't have access to PFF, so thanks for letting us know. Even though I thought we might have improved, that's better than what I would have thought. I further investigated this.... here is what I found.... As per this link...we are #5 in total yards rushing and #3 in yards per carry rushing. As per this link we have allowed 2.2 sacks per game for a rank of 11th best. All told, not too bad and reenforces what the PFF says. And as you point out, we are doing it with some backups. I have always been a believer that the offensive line matters. Maybe we are finally putting a good one together including back-ups. Take Kyler’s yards and yards per carry out of the equation. I’m not saying his run stats shouldn’t count, just that they weigh heavily and IMO should be seen differently, especially when many of those yards don’t come from designed runs. Without Kyler we have 535 rush yards (20th) and 4.5 yards per carry (14th). Kyler has 247 yards on 23 attempts for an incredible 10.7yards per carry. |
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Post by MT Diesel on Oct 12, 2024 5:28:10 GMT -7
I don't have access to PFF, so thanks for letting us know. Even though I thought we might have improved, that's better than what I would have thought. I further investigated this.... here is what I found.... As per this link...we are #5 in total yards rushing and #3 in yards per carry rushing. As per this link we have allowed 2.2 sacks per game for a rank of 11th best. All told, not too bad and reenforces what the PFF says. And as you point out, we are doing it with some backups. I have always been a believer that the offensive line matters. Maybe we are finally putting a good one together including back-ups. Thanks TC I knew there were some more good stats to back up the improving OL. We have seen so many OL groups missing at least one solid position player like center and the performance of the OL is bad. LT and center are the strengths and the coaches are working through the injury troubles. |
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Post by MT Diesel on Oct 12, 2024 5:40:16 GMT -7
I don't have access to PFF, so thanks for letting us know. Even though I thought we might have improved, that's better than what I would have thought. I further investigated this.... here is what I found.... As per this link...we are #5 in total yards rushing and #3 in yards per carry rushing. As per this link we have allowed 2.2 sacks per game for a rank of 11th best. All told, not too bad and reenforces what the PFF says. And as you point out, we are doing it with some backups. I have always been a believer that the offensive line matters. Maybe we are finally putting a good one together including back-ups. Take Kyler’s yards and yards per carry out of the equation. I’m not saying his run stats shouldn’t count, just that they weigh heavily and IMO should be seen differently, especially when many of those yards don’t come from designed runs. Without Kyler we have 535 rush yards (20th) and 4.5 yards per carry (14th). Kyler has 247 yards on 23 attempts for an incredible 10.7yards per carry. Philly and the Ravens are better run teams when their QBs are running at a good clip. K1 and his value doesn't discount the value of the OL. The K1 TD last week was by extension of the OL and a rookie. Tip blocking Bosa to the interior freed the edge and the QB to keep on the option read. Then to move off Bosa and take out Warner on the same play changes a small gain into a 50 yard TD. Tip is like an extra tackle on the OL. The TEs and their blocking have assisted the quality of the OL and the scheme. The real value in K1 is his threat to run, throwing accuracy and ability to get rid of the ball fast. Despite some lack of production by some 2024 additions and injuries, players like Tip are refreshing and continue to trend up. |
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Post by Dry Heat on Oct 12, 2024 10:34:14 GMT -7
Take Kyler’s yards and yards per carry out of the equation. I’m not saying his run stats shouldn’t count, just that they weigh heavily and IMO should be seen differently, especially when many of those yards don’t come from designed runs. Without Kyler we have 535 rush yards (20th) and 4.5 yards per carry (14th). Kyler has 247 yards on 23 attempts for an incredible 10.7yards per carry. Philly and the Ravens are better run teams when their QBs are running at a good clip. K1 and his value doesn't discount the value of the OL. The K1 TD last week was by extension of the OL and a rookie. Tip blocking Bosa to the interior freed the edge and the QB to keep on the option read. Then to move off Bosa and take out Warner on the same play changes a small gain into a 50 yard TD. Tip is like an extra tackle on the OL. The TEs and their blocking have assisted the quality of the OL and the scheme. The real value in K1 is his threat to run, throwing accuracy and ability to get rid of the ball fast. Despite some lack of production by some 2024 additions and injuries, players like Tip are refreshing and continue to trend up. I agree. As I said I’m not saying Kyler’s yards shouldn’t be ignored. I just feel running QB yards skew Oline rush grades. The 50 yard TD I definitely count as rush yards, as it was a designed run. But put a traditional statue QB behind our Oline and our rush grade simply wouldn’t be nearly as impressive. Kyler makes our total rush yards and yards per carry look far greater than what our Oline and RB’s are doing. |
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Post by CardSunsCard on Oct 12, 2024 15:27:07 GMT -7
Philly and the Ravens are better run teams when their QBs are running at a good clip. K1 and his value doesn't discount the value of the OL. The K1 TD last week was by extension of the OL and a rookie. Tip blocking Bosa to the interior freed the edge and the QB to keep on the option read. Then to move off Bosa and take out Warner on the same play changes a small gain into a 50 yard TD. Tip is like an extra tackle on the OL. The TEs and their blocking have assisted the quality of the OL and the scheme. The real value in K1 is his threat to run, throwing accuracy and ability to get rid of the ball fast. Despite some lack of production by some 2024 additions and injuries, players like Tip are refreshing and continue to trend up. I agree. As I said I’m not saying Kyler’s yards shouldn’t be ignored. I just feel running QB yards skew Oline rush grades. The 50 yard TD I definitely count as rush yards, as it was a designed run. But put a traditional statue QB behind our Oline and our rush grade simply wouldn’t be nearly as impressive. Kyler makes our total rush yards and yards per carry look far greater than what our Oline and RB’s are doing. Following that logic, wouldn't a traditional QB who gets rid of the ball quicker make our pass blocking look better? Let's be consistent whichever way we choose to analyze. Madden does a good job at importing up to date analytics and there's a reason the run blocking is strong for the first time in Madden history. (for the Cards) Especially if put Tip as your primary TE on run downs. The pass blocking doesn't rate near as strong, but with guys like Aaron Donald retiring, I just don't think our OL faces as much competition as it did in years past. There's Bosa and the Detroit kid, but the Rams/Niners aren't near as formadable as they used to be. Which may make our OL look better than it really is. |
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Post by MT Diesel on Oct 13, 2024 4:02:50 GMT -7
I agree. As I said I’m not saying Kyler’s yards shouldn’t be ignored. I just feel running QB yards skew Oline rush grades. The 50 yard TD I definitely count as rush yards, as it was a designed run. But put a traditional statue QB behind our Oline and our rush grade simply wouldn’t be nearly as impressive. Kyler makes our total rush yards and yards per carry look far greater than what our Oline and RB’s are doing. Following that logic, wouldn't a traditional QB who gets rid of the ball quicker make our pass blocking look better? Let's be consistent whichever way we choose to analyze. Madden does a good job at importing up to date analytics and there's a reason the run blocking is strong for the first time in Madden history. (for the Cards) Especially if put Tip as your primary TE on run downs. The pass blocking doesn't rate near as strong, but with guys like Aaron Donald retiring, I just don't think our OL faces as much competition as it did in years past. There's Bosa and the Detroit kid, but the Rams/Niners aren't near as formadable as they used to be. Which may make our OL look better than it really is. Thanks CSC I am of the camp you are who you are. The OL is the top third of the OLs in the NFL...which is a win and a positive change in the desert. Much like K1 being a top 10 QB some give reasons why they dispute it like, he is too short or he can't see over the OL...he is a top 10 QB despite what knocks people want to put on him. With what K1 adds doesn't change that the OL is a quality OL. |
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Post by cardinalsdo on Oct 13, 2024 11:10:16 GMT -7
This is nothing we don't already know. Even last year, our pass blocking was decent. The problem is they can't run block and particularly block inside. Thus we become one dimensional. We need to stop pretending we have a great offensive line. Every year, this forum touts the OL as a strength. It's not, it's a huge weakness. We need to draft better OL overall. And we need acquire an increased number and better quality interior OL (Guards and Center).
Kyler Murray is not a top 10 QB. He is not as bad as some tout but he is not a top 10 QB. Right now, Mahomes, Allen, L. Jackson, Stroud, J. Daniels, Prescott, Burrow, Goff, Hurts, Love, Stafford and Purdy are all better. I would argue Cousins, and Tua (when healthy) are better.
Kyler gets a large share of the blame for the Cardinals struggels when he doesn't have an offensive line. As a result we have no running game and our line is poor at picking up the blitz. Look at the Packers game today for proof
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Post by Dry Heat on Oct 13, 2024 13:31:12 GMT -7
This is nothing we don't already know. Even last year, our pass blocking was decent. The problem is they can't run block and particularly block inside. Thus we become one dimensional. We need to stop pretending we have a great offensive line. Every year, this forum touts the OL as a strength. It's not, it's a huge weakness. We need to draft better OL overall. And we need acquire an increased number and better quality interior OL (Guards and Center).
Kyler Murray is not a top 10 QB. He is not as bad as some tout but he is not a top 10 QB. Right now, Mahomes, Allen, L. Jackson, Stroud, J. Daniels, Prescott, Burrow, Goff, Hurts, Love, Stafford and Purdy are all better. I would argue Cousins, and Tua (when healthy) are better.
Kyler gets a large share of the blame for the Cardinals struggels when he doesn't have an offensive line. As a result we have no running game and our line is poor at picking up the blitz. Look at the Packers game today for proof
Goff is better?! No, the Lions are better than the Cardinals, but Goff is not better than Kyler. Hurts is better?! Maybe. Not before todays game this season. And through five games Kyler was the best QB in our division. Stafford is aging out. Eight guys you list are better. 23 NFL QBs are worse. Caleb Williams finally looked good today. |
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Post by MT Diesel on Oct 13, 2024 14:25:59 GMT -7
Two right-side starters are injured and Brown goes down with injury and the OL isn't the problem.
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Post by vwvectors on Oct 13, 2024 20:29:26 GMT -7
This is nothing we don't already know. Even last year, our pass blocking was decent. The problem is they can't run block and particularly block inside. Thus we become one dimensional. We need to stop pretending we have a great offensive line. Every year, this forum touts the OL as a strength. It's not, it's a huge weakness. We need to draft better OL overall. And we need acquire an increased number and better quality interior OL (Guards and Center).
Kyler Murray is not a top 10 QB. He is not as bad as some tout but he is not a top 10 QB. Right now, Mahomes, Allen, L. Jackson, Stroud, J. Daniels, Prescott, Burrow, Goff, Hurts, Love, Stafford and Purdy are all better. I would argue Cousins, and Tua (when healthy) are better.
Kyler gets a large share of the blame for the Cardinals struggels when he doesn't have an offensive line. As a result we have no running game and our line is poor at picking up the blitz. Look at the Packers game today for proof
I think most on here (myself included) have thought of our OL as average at best. IMO it’s been that way since we drafted Levi Brown the human turnstile. Also I’m not upset we drafted MHJ but I would have drafted Joe Alt instead & if draft were held today I’d do the same. |
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Post by End Zone on Oct 14, 2024 2:13:29 GMT -7
GB was the second team to run at will against the Cardinals' defense this year, accumulating almost 200 yards on the ground. A superior OL schooled the Cardinals' defense, pushing our guys around like High School varsity players.
How was the GB OL built? Some Draft. Some FAs. The GB managers also searched for solid QB material and are patient with their QB prospects. QB Jordan Love is a much better QB than Kyler Murray.
There are several NFL lessons the Cardinals have never passed. Building a great OL is an urgent task, especially when the long-term quarterback is Kyler Murray.
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Post by kennydorglas on Oct 14, 2024 3:39:10 GMT -7
This is nothing we don't already know. Even last year, our pass blocking was decent. The problem is they can't run block and particularly block inside. Thus we become one dimensional. We need to stop pretending we have a great offensive line. Every year, this forum touts the OL as a strength. It's not, it's a huge weakness. We need to draft better OL overall. And we need acquire an increased number and better quality interior OL (Guards and Center).
Kyler Murray is not a top 10 QB. He is not as bad as some tout but he is not a top 10 QB. Right now, Mahomes, Allen, L. Jackson, Stroud, J. Daniels, Prescott, Burrow, Goff, Hurts, Love, Stafford and Purdy are all better. I would argue Cousins, and Tua (when healthy) are better.
Kyler gets a large share of the blame for the Cardinals struggels when he doesn't have an offensive line. As a result we have no running game and our line is poor at picking up the blitz. Look at the Packers game today for proof
I think most on here (myself included) have thought of our OL as average at best. IMO it’s been that way since we drafted Levi Brown the human turnstile. Also I’m not upset we drafted MHJ but I would have drafted Joe Alt instead & if draft were held today I’d do the same. Getting MHjr when your qb is kyler none murray and it's been pressured at literally every snap. Ok mhjr might be a unicorn and possible goat, but a new WR was probably OUR LAST NEED ans every good team traded his overpaid WR for cheaper ones as they're now what RB used to be in few years before. |
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