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Post by FLCardinalFan on Apr 23, 2024 19:28:13 GMT -7
WE ARE SO READY! 11 PICKS OR MORE WOW!
We are getting Close to what could be the turning point for The Arizona Cardinals franchise. Yes I have expressed concerns about scouting and some of the moves in last year's draft. The results on the field will decide the outcome of this and last year's draft Monti doesn't get a free pass even though It was an instant upgrade at GM. Expressing concerns is not berating or bashing the GM. It is wanting the best for the team you have followed all your life. Last year's class was a great start. Time to DOMINATE THIS DRAFT IN 2024!
I'll be the first to admit I get players wrong. Look at Isaiah Simmons no longer with the team. I missed it, I was intrigued by 4.37 speed and wingspan, stuff like that. But I get some things right too. Case in point, I got laughed on the forum at when we drafted QB Logan Thomas and I said we need to move him to tight end. Bruce Arians was too stubborn to try it. Well, Over on the Washington Commanders roster is tight end Logan Thomas. He is still in the NFL playing tight end.
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Post by MT Diesel on Apr 23, 2024 19:50:10 GMT -7
WE ARE SO READY! 11 PICKS OR MORE WOW!We are getting Close to what could be the turning point for The Arizona Cardinals franchise. Yes I have expressed concerns about scouting and some of the moves in last year's draft. The results on the field will decide the outcome of this and last year's draft Monti doesn't get a free pass even though It was an instant upgrade at GM. Expressing concerns is not berating or bashing the GM. It is wanting the best for the team
you have followed all your life. Last year's class was a great start. Time to DOMINATE THIS DRAFT IN 2024! I'll be the first to admit I get players wrong. Look at Isaiah Simmons no longer with the team. I missed it, I was intrigued by 4.37 speed and wingspan, stuff like that. But I get some things right too. Case in point, I got laughed on the forum at when we drafted QB Logan Thomas and I said we need to move him to tight end. Bruce Arians was too stubborn to try it. Well, Over on the Washington Commanders roster is tight end Logan Thomas. He is still in the NFL playing tight end.
I love this part of the season and the Cards are undefeated so far in 2024. Looks like Cam Thomas is needing a major turn around for my thoughts on him before SK drafted to have any accuracy. I knew there would be a challenge for him to transition from edge to IDL. He is young and building the muscle mass on his big frame takes time and the extra mass doesn't help his speed on the edge...he is still on the team and it is make or break it year for him in AZ. Your boy was disappointing once his mind moved on from being coach-able.
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Post by belac44 on Apr 23, 2024 20:57:44 GMT -7
Curious what people on here think about a trade up that someone mocked earlier today.
27 and 35 for 12 and draft Dallas Turner. Cards landed Harrison at 4 in this scenario.
I would not do that myself, but curious of others thoughts.
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Post by FLCardinalFan on Apr 24, 2024 1:44:12 GMT -7
Curious what people on here think about a trade up that someone mocked earlier today. 27 and 35 for 12 and draft Dallas Turner. Cards landed Harrison at 4 in this scenario. I would not do that myself, but curious of others thoughts. I read yesterday that this year's Edge rusher class is very weak AThe guy was not sold on T urner. I'll try and find article.If he is there at #15
in a no trade scenario, That will tell us the same thing,
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Post by CardsFanQC on Apr 24, 2024 3:27:57 GMT -7
Curious what people on here think about a trade up that someone mocked earlier today. 27 and 35 for 12 and draft Dallas Turner. Cards landed Harrison at 4 in this scenario. I would not do that myself, but curious of others thoughts. NO .... IMO Turner should have had more production for his physical skill-set. Right now, Latu's medical concerns have dissipated quite a bit with a recent favorable medical report. Latu is +250 to be the first defensive player to be drafted. Jared Verse -- He had 6.5 of his 9 sacks come against Virginia Tech, Wake Forest and Florida. Interesting now Latu's moving up draft boards -- makes the odds of Odunze falling to #11 for the Cards if the Vikings are forced to give Monti what he wants for #4. Yesterday's Yahoo Report insinuating the Vikings could be interested in drafting Bo Nix rather than giving Monti is asking price is laughable. Benjamin Albright says in talking with GM's - Nix might be an early 3rd rounder. The Vikes trade for the Cardinals is interesting because the top 11 could go - 1) Bears - Caleb Williams 2) Commanders- Jaydon Daniels 3) Patriots - Drake Maye 4) Vikings - JJ McCarthy 5) Chargers - MHJ 6) Giants - Nabers 7) Titans - Joe Alt 8) Falcons - Dallas Turner (saw on ESPN where the Falcons are DEAD LAST in sacks over the last 3 seasons) 9) Bears - Latu 10) Jets - Brock Bowers 11) Cardinals - Rome Odunze WR, WashingtonThe trade up to #12 to get Dallas Turner is not a good trade as Turner has been heavily mocked to Falcons for a month to go after Dallas Turner. My targeted defensive player in 1st round would be Bryon Murphy and Monti should want to jump ahead of BOTH Bengals-Rams and trade with the Jaguars. Trade would be pick #17 for #27 - #66 (these picks for #17 is within 10 pts of each other on the draft value chart) so you might need to throw in the lower 5th Rd pick or the 6th. If the Vikes trade happens, Monti could trade #23 and #71 for #17 and #116 (JAGUARS). If the above top 10 picks occurs in 2 days and Monti could pull off this trade with Jax then the Cards would have Odunze WR and consensus #1 DL Byron Murphy while still retaining picks #27 - #35 - #66 ... not bad!
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Post by End Zone on Apr 24, 2024 3:57:46 GMT -7
Curious what people on here think about a trade up that someone mocked earlier today. 27 and 35 for 12 and draft Dallas Turner. Cards landed Harrison at 4 in this scenario. I would not do that myself, but curious of others thoughts. I like Turner. But who would sink from low-risk #12 to medium-risk #27/#35? I'm not sure I'd take that risk unless I was a very good team already and needed 1-2 parts to get 100% well. Also, Turner is not free from criticism. Is he #12 worthy?
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Post by End Zone on Apr 24, 2024 4:07:53 GMT -7
Curious what people on here think about a trade up that someone mocked earlier today. 27 and 35 for 12 and draft Dallas Turner. Cards landed Harrison at 4 in this scenario. I would not do that myself, but curious of others thoughts. NO .... IMO Turner should have had more production for his physical skill-set. Right now, Latu's medical concerns have dissipated quite a bit with a recent favorable medical report. Latu is +250 to be the first defensive player to be drafted. Jared Verse -- He had 6.5 of his 9 sacks come against Virginia Tech, Wake Forest and Florida. Interesting now Latu's moving up draft boards -- makes the odds of Odunze falling to #11 for the Cards if the Vikings are forced to give Monti what he wants for #4. Yesterday's Yahoo Report insinuating the Vikings could be interested in drafting Bo Nix rather than giving Monti is asking price is laughable. Benjamin Albright says in talking with GM's - Nix might be an early 3rd rounder. The Vikes trade for the Cardinals is interesting because the top 11 could go - 1) Bears - Caleb Williams 2) Commanders- Jaydon Daniels 3) Patriots - Drake Maye 4) Vikings - JJ McCarthy 5) Chargers - MHJ 6) Giants - Nabers 7) Titans - Joe Alt 8) Falcons - Dallas Turner (saw on ESPN where the Falcons are DEAD LAST in sacks over the last 3 seasons) 9) Bears - Latu 10) Jets - Brock Bowers 11) Cardinals - Rome Odunze WR, WashingtonThe trade up to #12 to get Dallas Turner is not a good trade as Turner has been heavily mocked to Falcons for a month to go after Dallas Turner. My targeted defensive player in 1st round would be Bryon Murphy and Monti should want to jump ahead of BOTH Bengals-Rams and trade with the Jaguars. Trade would be pick #17 for #27 - #66 (these picks for #17 is within 10 pts of each other on the draft value chart) so you might need to throw in the lower 5th Rd pick or the 6th. If the Vikes trade happens, Monti could trade #23 and #71 for #17 and #116 (JAGUARS). If the above top 10 picks occurs in 2 days and Monti could pull off this trade with Jax then the Cards would have Odunze WR and consensus #1 DL Byron Murphy while still retaining picks #27 - #35 - #66 ... not bad! If that 1-11 rank is reality by late Thursday night, it sucks, IMV. I rank Harrison/Odunze/Nabers and then Bowers. MIN has to offer a huge bounty of 1st round picks for me to drop out of the Top 10 and miss out on H/O/N. I don't see #11 happening for Bowers. MO will trade back up, maybe using MIN's picks to get a WR. Also, Turner at #8 is surprising. But ATL is sucking wind on the Edge. Cousins needs sack help on the other side of the ball.
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Post by CardsFanQC on Apr 24, 2024 6:27:57 GMT -7
NO .... IMO Turner should have had more production for his physical skill-set. Right now, Latu's medical concerns have dissipated quite a bit with a recent favorable medical report. Latu is +250 to be the first defensive player to be drafted. Jared Verse -- He had 6.5 of his 9 sacks come against Virginia Tech, Wake Forest and Florida. Interesting now Latu's moving up draft boards -- makes the odds of Odunze falling to #11 for the Cards if the Vikings are forced to give Monti what he wants for #4. Yesterday's Yahoo Report insinuating the Vikings could be interested in drafting Bo Nix rather than giving Monti is asking price is laughable. Benjamin Albright says in talking with GM's - Nix might be an early 3rd rounder. The Vikes trade for the Cardinals is interesting because the top 11 could go - 1) Bears - Caleb Williams 2) Commanders- Jaydon Daniels 3) Patriots - Drake Maye 4) Vikings - JJ McCarthy 5) Chargers - MHJ 6) Giants - Nabers 7) Titans - Joe Alt 8) Falcons - Dallas Turner (saw on ESPN where the Falcons are DEAD LAST in sacks over the last 3 seasons) 9) Bears - Latu 10) Jets - Brock Bowers 11) Cardinals - Rome Odunze WR, WashingtonThe trade up to #12 to get Dallas Turner is not a good trade as Turner has been heavily mocked to Falcons for a month to go after Dallas Turner. My targeted defensive player in 1st round would be Bryon Murphy and Monti should want to jump ahead of BOTH Bengals-Rams and trade with the Jaguars. Trade would be pick #17 for #27 - #66 (these picks for #17 is within 10 pts of each other on the draft value chart) so you might need to throw in the lower 5th Rd pick or the 6th. If the Vikes trade happens, Monti could trade #23 and #71 for #17 and #116 (JAGUARS). If the above top 10 picks occurs in 2 days and Monti could pull off this trade with Jax then the Cards would have Odunze WR and consensus #1 DL Byron Murphy while still retaining picks #27 - #35 - #66 ... not bad! If that 1-11 rank is reality by late Thursday night, it sucks, IMV. I rank Harrison/Odunze/Nabers and then Bowers. MIN has to offer a huge bounty of 1st round picks for me to drop out of the Top 10 and miss out on H/O/N. I don't see #11 happening for Bowers. MO will trade back up, maybe using MIN's picks to get a WR. Also, Turner at #8 is surprising. But ATL is sucking wind on the Edge. Cousins needs sack help on the other side of the ball. I am pretty confident in the first 8 players above (might be different teams but I do believe the top 8 players above are considered in the same tier by teams). Bears don't have many picks and Monti may need to move up 2 spots with the Bears though the Bears are thought to either pick Odunze or Turner/Verse/Latu.
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Post by belac44 on Apr 24, 2024 19:33:08 GMT -7
I do not love any of the first round edge guys. I can see some value and good traits, but I am not needing any. I feel we can get someone later that can be effective. I will be hopeful if they love someone and go get him, but not those picks for Turner. If someone falls into the 20’s they love and we can give up a later third and 27 then so be it.
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Post by CardsFanQC on Apr 25, 2024 3:09:49 GMT -7
I do not love any of the first round edge guys. I can see some value and good traits, but I am not needing any. I feel we can get someone later that can be effective. I will be hopeful if they love someone and go get him, but not those picks for Turner. If someone falls into the 20’s they love and we can give up a later third and 27 then so be it. I agree with your assessment on the consensus top 4 edge guys; however I know Latu is flying up draft boards due to his recent positive medical reports. In fact I am not so sure Latu has not surpassed Turner to be selected by the Falcons at #8 though there have been rumors Atlanta wouldn't mind a trade down to get additional picks (if true that means they view all the top edge guys pretty equally). The Falcons would seem to be a natural Cardinals trade partner if the Vikings trade deal happens since Odunze is being mocked a lot to either Bears or Jets. NOTE: Latu is now -290 to be selected in top 16 whereas 2 weeks ago I thought the Cardinals might have a chance at him @ #23 if Monti did the Vikings trade. BTW: These seems to be an interesting and plausible bet - CARDINALS - Rome Odunze to be first pick, Darius Robinson to be second pick +8500 MY BELIEF: Cardinals need to get either Byron Murphy (probably in trade up to mid to late teens or J. Newton (could be there at #27 - would be nice to have pick #23 from Vikings to either stick and pick or trade up to #20 [Steelers] to jump ahead of Dolphins looking to replace Christian Wilkins. My belief is a 3 - technique who is very good at applying pass rush pressure from the interior defensive line makes the job a lot easier for edge guys to be one-on-one vs. OL increasing their effectiveness. My dream draft would be MHJ - Murphy/Newton in 1st round and then 20 yr old Jonah Ellis, Utah with pick #66. NOTE: Apparently Newton is slipping due to concern about his foot so #35 would be fantastic if possible. If somehow Newton could be had at #35, then perfect draft is MHJ- Cooper DeJean at #27 - Newton and then still Jonah Ellis at #66 Some observations/rumors about the draft - LOTS OF TRADES Some team sources said they think there could be more trade movement in this year’s draft compared to typical years. They shared they believe this movement could start in the middle of the first round, stretch into late in Round 1, and then continue throughout the second day of the 2024 NFL Draft. The reason for the expected fluidity is teams feeling there is a lack of talent on Day 3 of the draft thanks to the influence of NIL in college football and more players getting paid to stay in school. That has weakened the talent depth of the draft, leaving teams believing that third-day picks have less value. Some sources from playoff teams felt that there is a good chance that the players they would get on Day 3 of the 2024 NFL Draft would have a very hard time making their final 53-man roster, so rather than use the pick on a player who is likely to get cut, they could use the pick to move up in the early rounds. This year’s draft has the potential to be one with a lot of trades, starting on the opening night of the draft. Some Players will Slide due to Character Concerns and some Over/Under Rated Players per GM's:While Nabers has some teams rating him ahead of Harrison, one thing going for Harrison is there are teams that have some character concerns with Nabers. Harrison did not come up with character concerns. Sources from multiple teams with top-10 picks said they had character marks for Nabers. That being said, they said the character was not bad enough to cause them to pass on him based on the questions or remove him from their draft board. Thus, Nabers looks like a near lock for the top six of the 2024 NFL Draft. Another wide receiver who has been hurt by character and makeup concerns is Texas’ Adonai Mitchell. NFL teams found character issues with Mitchell at Texas and from his early years at Georgia. Another factor that has hurt Mitchell is franchises feeling he does a poor job of managing his Type-1 diabetes. Mitchell has a first-round skill set, but if he slides to very late in the first round or to the second round, it will be because of the character issues and concerns with how he manages his diabetes. Other prospects have had major character issues that have really hurt them with NFL teams. Some NFL sources said their teams had dropped Ohio State defensive tackle Michael Hall Jr., Alabama wide receiver Jermaine Burton and Texas defensive tackle T’Vondre Sweat off their draft boards because of character. All three have early-round skill sets, but each could slide in the 2024 NFL Draft because of character problems. Every year, there are some prospects that benefit from a lot of media hype and others who don’t receive the attention they deserve. WalterFootball.com surveyed team sources as to which players were being overrated and overhyped, as well as which players they considered underrated Overrated
Zach Frazier, C, West Virginia Roger Rosengarten, OT, Washington (Mel Kiper has him as a 1st rounder) Graham Barton, OL, Duke Underrated
Keon Coleman, WR, Florida State Kris Jenkins, DT, Michigan Sedrick Van Pran-Granger, C, Georgia
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Post by End Zone on Apr 25, 2024 4:02:00 GMT -7
I do not love any of the first round edge guys. I can see some value and good traits, but I am not needing any. I feel we can get someone later that can be effective. I will be hopeful if they love someone and go get him, but not those picks for Turner. If someone falls into the 20’s they love and we can give up a later third and 27 then so be it. I agree with your assessment on the consensus top 4 edge guys; however I know Latu is flying up draft boards due to his recent positive medical reports. In fact I am not so sure Latu has not surpassed Turner to be selected by the Falcons at #8 though there have been rumors Atlanta wouldn't mind a trade down to get additional picks (if true that means they view all the top edge guys pretty equally). The Falcons would seem to be a natural Cardinals trade partner if the Vikings trade deal happens since Odunze is being mocked a lot to either Bears or Jets. NOTE: Latu is now -290 to be selected in top 16 whereas 2 weeks ago I thought the Cardinals might have a chance at him @ #23 if Monti did the Vikings trade. BTW: These seems to be an interesting and plausible bet - CARDINALS - Rome Odunze to be first pick, Darius Robinson to be second pick +8500 MY BELIEF: Cardinals need to get either Byron Murphy (probably in trade up to mid to late teens or J. Newton (could be there at #27 - would be nice to have pick #23 from Vikings to either stick and pick or trade up to #20 [Steelers] to jump ahead of Dolphins looking to replace Christian Wilkins. My belief is a 3 - technique who is very good at applying pass rush pressure from the interior defensive line makes the job a lot easier for edge guys to be one-on-one vs. OL increasing their effectiveness. My dream draft would be MHJ - Murphy/Newton in 1st round and then 20 yr old Jonah Ellis, Utah with pick #66. NOTE: Apparently Newton is slipping due to concern about his foot so #35 would be fantastic if possible. If somehow Newton could be had at #35, then perfect draft is MHJ- Cooper DeJean at #27 - Newton and then still Jonah Ellis at #66 Some observations/rumors about the draft - LOTS OF TRADES Some team sources said they think there could be more trade movement in this year’s draft compared to typical years. They shared they believe this movement could start in the middle of the first round, stretch into late in Round 1, and then continue throughout the second day of the 2024 NFL Draft. The reason for the expected fluidity is teams feeling there is a lack of talent on Day 3 of the draft thanks to the influence of NIL in college football and more players getting paid to stay in school. That has weakened the talent depth of the draft, leaving teams believing that third-day picks have less value. Some sources from playoff teams felt that there is a good chance that the players they would get on Day 3 of the 2024 NFL Draft would have a very hard time making their final 53-man roster, so rather than use the pick on a player who is likely to get cut, they could use the pick to move up in the early rounds. This year’s draft has the potential to be one with a lot of trades, starting on the opening night of the draft. Some Players will Slide due to Character Concerns and some Over/Under Rated Players per GM's:While Nabers has some teams rating him ahead of Harrison, one thing going for Harrison is there are teams that have some character concerns with Nabers. Harrison did not come up with character concerns. Sources from multiple teams with top-10 picks said they had character marks for Nabers. That being said, they said the character was not bad enough to cause them to pass on him based on the questions or remove him from their draft board. Thus, Nabers looks like a near lock for the top six of the 2024 NFL Draft. Another wide receiver who has been hurt by character and makeup concerns is Texas’ Adonai Mitchell. NFL teams found character issues with Mitchell at Texas and from his early years at Georgia. Another factor that has hurt Mitchell is franchises feeling he does a poor job of managing his Type-1 diabetes. Mitchell has a first-round skill set, but if he slides to very late in the first round or to the second round, it will be because of the character issues and concerns with how he manages his diabetes. Other prospects have had major character issues that have really hurt them with NFL teams. Some NFL sources said their teams had dropped Ohio State defensive tackle Michael Hall Jr., Alabama wide receiver Jermaine Burton and Texas defensive tackle T’Vondre Sweat off their draft boards because of character. All three have early-round skill sets, but each could slide in the 2024 NFL Draft because of character problems. Every year, there are some prospects that benefit from a lot of media hype and others who don’t receive the attention they deserve. WalterFootball.com surveyed team sources as to which players were being overrated and overhyped, as well as which players they considered underrated Overrated
Zach Frazier, C, West Virginia Roger Rosengarten, OT, Washington (Mel Kiper has him as a 1st rounder) Graham Barton, OL, Duke Underrated Keon Coleman, WR, Florida StateKris Jenkins, DT, Michigan Sedrick Van Pran-Granger, C, Georgia About the 'underrated list,' I think 6'4" WR Coleman also got indirectly screwed by the NCAAF Playoffs decisionmakers. FSU was perfect as records go but the decisionmakers didn't want to showcase a team that didn't beat a Goliath. The NFL rates Coleman around 6.24, or average skills and a starter 'someday.' If that value doesn't move, Coleman might be a Day 3 pick, 5th Round. That day will be rough on him and the pocketbook.
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Post by belac44 on Apr 25, 2024 9:10:34 GMT -7
I am not sure why people just stopped talking about Keon Coleman. He is an absolute beast. I just wonder if he is kind of seen like N’Keal Harry and it wont translate to NFL. That is the only thing that makes sense to me and I understand if that is the concern.
I would love Graham Barton. I’ve mentioned other places, Walter Football lost credibility with their admiration of Mike Jurecki.
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Post by jeffcardinalfan on Apr 25, 2024 12:33:54 GMT -7
I'm getting back on the soapbox again. In my humble opinion regardless of whether any trades are made or not the Cardinals first three picks have to be wide receiver, CB or DL in the first round and second round the best interior offensive lineman on the board. And I just read what I posted and that would imply there would be no trade. So if there is some type of trade where the Cardinals end up with three first round picks then I would say the first four pics have to be wide receiver, cb, DL, and best interior offensive line on the board.
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Post by CardCore on Apr 25, 2024 14:30:02 GMT -7
Does either Walter have this right?
Walter Mitchel over at ROTBs has an article wherein he's pleading for the Cards to draft Mi CB Mike Sainristil,due to the fact the Card braintrust has ignored the dire need of a slot CB for the Cards to compete in the NFC West. (For years) He stated he would take the guy tonight at 27. I went to Walter Cherpinsky's site to see where he had the guy ranked. He was like the 16th ranked CB and was shown as a Rd 3 or 4 pick.
All I can really add is that Rome Odunze was held in check pretty well in that championship game (basically shut down) against Mi. and Sainristil may have played a big part in that, although he was likely double teamed a lot in that game.
Edit: I see that Zirlein has the guy rated as a 2nd round talent...something tells me that is probably pretty close.
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Post by cardinalsins on Apr 25, 2024 15:31:47 GMT -7
Curious what people on here think about a trade up that someone mocked earlier today. 27 and 35 for 12 and draft Dallas Turner. Cards landed Harrison at 4 in this scenario. I would not do that myself, but curious of others thoughts. That's too much. I'm up for trading up for Edge...or Newton. Not giving up 35 though
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